Rates from brokers

Oct 27, 2018 at 09:18 AM CST
+ 12 - 2
Is there a reason the brokers dont post there rates and commodity? It would save time in my opinion, what do you all think?
Replied on Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 11:20 AM CST
+ 2 - 1
Not all posted rates are correct.
Bait and switch
Replied on Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 02:42 PM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: LAWRENCE SCHIRATO
Quote: "Not all posted rates are correct. Bait and switch"

True but noone hauls without calling, so you would think it would do no good.
Replied on Sun, Oct 28, 2018 at 10:26 AM CST
+ 6
Originally Posted by: RANDY SWOPES
Quote: "True but noone hauls without calling, so you would think it would do no good."

You would also think that no one would haul a load for [email protected] mile either but it happens everyday.
Replied on Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 07:20 AM CST
+ 4
I learned over a little time that the loads listed are the cheap back haul loads but by calling and talking to the brokers, I find out about the loads they have that they don't post, the higher paying ones.
Replied on Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:25 AM CST
+ 2 - 1
Coy, I consistently post loads that $2.50+ a mile that load in and out within 80 miles of where you live. Not everyone is posting back hauls.
Replied on Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:25 AM CST
Coy, I consistently post loads that pay you$2.50+ a mile that load in and out within 80 miles of where you live. Not everyone is posting back hauls.
Replied on Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 10:35 AM CST
+ 4
agreed, if the rates and commodity was posted we would definitly consider more loads off this site
Replied on Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 05:49 PM CST
+ 2
What I should have put in my previous post was what the company I sometimes pull for told me they do. I see a lot of comments about cheap rates and I don't guess I know what is considered cheap. I do a lot of local runs, round trip loads that pay from the mid threes to 6 and 7 a loaded mile. But again I run loaded up and empty back to reload.
Replied on Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 07:44 AM CST
+ 4

We have been in business for 17 years and we post rates on 99.9% of our loads and commodity is posted as well. There are "shady" folks on BOTH sides of the equation but as a rule most players are honest.

Check us out if you wish!

Replied on Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 10:06 AM CST
+ 4
Sometimes our clients don't have a target rate. Also, soetimes there is a big gap in between the low, average and the high. This way carriers call in and I can relate that back to the customer, so their pay is more realistic.
Replied on Wed, Nov 07, 2018 at 08:52 AM CST
- 4
Trick you into calling
Replied on Wed, Nov 07, 2018 at 05:21 PM CST
+ 13
Originally Posted by: COY WALTON
Quote: "I learned over a little time that the loads listed are the cheap back haul loads but by calling and talking to the brokers, I find out about the loads they have that they don't post, the higher paying ones."

There is no such thing as a "back haul"! The truck has a certain amount of money that each mile needs to make, be it going away from home or back to home. The sooner people stop settling for "back hauls" the sooner the rates will come up! Simple math!
Replied on Thu, Nov 08, 2018 at 11:10 AM CST
+ 3 - 2
Originally Posted by: ED MCCONNELL
Quote: "There is no such thing as a "back haul"! The truck has a certain amount of money that each mile needs to make, be it going away from home or back to home. The sooner people stop settling for "back hauls" the sooner the rates will come up! Simple math!"

Howdy Ed

I don't want to start a "thing" but there are most certainly backhaul and headhaul rates. For better or worse, our brokerage has survived and grown on pushing lumber around the country on "backhaul" rates. Also, there are many business factors that influence when a carrier will/should and will not/should not take a load.

When I worked pushing reefers we had good customer freight from AR to NJ, PA, NJ, MA at $3+ a mile. But when I am in Philly or Buffalo, no load home and I had to get back for customer capacity commitments and driver hometime, you bet i'd take $1.25-$1.50 to get home. I didn't like it, but it worked big picture. Just my $.02
Replied on Thu, Nov 08, 2018 at 04:04 PM CST
+ 2
we call that a round trip up here and should be quoted as such. then the carrier gets the whole picture, not just your take on costs.
Replied on Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 07:10 AM CST
How about take weekly income and divide it by weekly miles. And do your simple math. $1.50 a mile is better than running empty like in a parade or something.
Replied on Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 07:30 AM CST
+ 1
Unless you are driving a 10000 dollar truck driving loaded at 1.50 per mile is costing you more money than driving empty for free
Replied on Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 08:33 AM CST
+ 2
Originally Posted by: NANCY HARDER
Quote: "we call that a round trip up here and should be quoted as such. then the carrier gets the whole picture, not just your take on costs."

With all due respect, my example is not a round trip. They are two distinct transactions that are decided on individually.
Replied on Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 09:24 AM CST
+ 5
Some people just don’t get it and never will and that why rates across the board will stay low. I like trucking that all I’ve ever done but we do it to make a living not to get by or break even. I’m not trying to get rich but I like to have a nice rig and live comfortable. Until all the “backhaulers”quit taking taking cheap loads or the guy that’s scared to turn a cheap load down thinking he won’t have work nothing will change. All it would take is 1 week for every driver to tell them “No” and Guess what across the boards the rate goes up. We control that until they find a driver that takes the rate. Yes I know I just wasted a good twenty minutes I’ll never get back. Some people don’t realize that the brokers or merchandisers are sometimes making half what the truck is making sometimes more or less but that’s how much money they are playing with. So think about that the next time a broker says he can’t pay more because in reality he won’t say that his famous words are I can get someone to do it for less. I’ve told brokers I’ll bounce home before I’ll haul that for nothing and put money in your pocket but they will call ur bluff until they know you’ll do it. Well it’s time to open the flood gate of criticism and hit post. Y’all have a great day and keep the rubber side down!
Replied on Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 10:17 AM CST
+ 4
I think some people just don't truly know the cost just to drive the truck. And the cost is different load compared to empty. Not calling anybody dumb, because 6 months ago I was of the opinion that taking a load for 1.70 a mile was making me more money than driving empty....wrong. it costs me 1.25 per mile to drive empty. It costs me 1.90 to drive loaded, that 1.90 is just the cost. Not profit. I learned that by doing a balance sheet after a discussion I had on bulk loads about farming, so thanks to Alfred for teaching me to not be an idiot.
Replied on Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 12:48 PM CST
William, you make an awesome point about meeting customer requirements. Example, I have a weekly regular customer that I bring a product to, it's a short run, ties in perfectly with another weekly run. It's only a 380 dollar load but it ups my overall dollars per mile for the trip by .40. well due to planning for other loads I had to go out of my way to get them their product this week, which I'm happy to do for them, it added 300 miles for 380 dollars. But the dollar per loaded mile didn't change. I'm personally content to take it in the shorts on that load that time , because they are a good, regular customer, and that's just logistically how it played out this week. But again, it didn't change the fact that the load is still 2.40 per loaded mile
Replied on Sun, Nov 11, 2018 at 10:20 AM CST
- 1
I totally agree, it's a waste of my time to email them about rates and what's being hauled because most don't respond anyway,nor if they do more times than not you can't negotiate the it anyway!!!!
Replied on Sun, Nov 11, 2018 at 05:35 PM CST
+ 1 - 1
Is it me or has anyone else noticed how the individuals that have all the advice and all the experience in the transportation industry have farm in there business name. Nothing against farmers (no farms no food) and I like to eat. But the way It works for me is the more money the truck makes the more money i make. I have done loads under $2 per mile do I like it absolutely not. But it sure beats having something to and make a little bit rather than do nothing and make nothing my truck costs me weather I run it or not. If you got food in your mouth your bills paid and some cash at the end of the week. Congratulations you did alright.
Replied on Mon, Nov 12, 2018 at 07:45 AM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: PETE WENGER
Quote: "Is it me or has anyone else noticed how the individuals that have all the advice and all the experience in the transportation industry have farm in there business name. Nothing against farmers (no farms no food) and I like to eat. But the way It works for me is the more money the truck makes the more money i make. I have done loads under $2 per mile do I like it absolutely not. But it sure beats having something to and make a little bit rather than do nothing and make nothing my truck costs me weather I run it or not. If you got food in your mouth your bills paid and some cash at the end of the week. Congratulations you did alright."

please elaborate on your statement about companies with farm in our name? because without an explanation i assume that you believe that just because we handle manure and dirt, our business education is less relevant than yours? we just provided our input. nobody is forcing you to read what we type. i dont think any of us farmers are claiming to be better than anybody, but if my post about my personal costs to drive help someone out that is just getting started, (because that balance sheet would have helped me alot back in february) then i feel pretty good about that, if my farmer named posts annoy you, dont read the dang thing
Replied on Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 02:52 PM CST
+ 4
Originally Posted by: DALE HERMANS
Quote: "please elaborate on your statement about companies with farm in our name? because without an explanation i assume that you believe that just because we handle manure and dirt, our business education is less relevant than yours? we just provided our input. nobody is forcing you to read what we type. i dont think any of us farmers are claiming to be better than anybody, but if my post about my personal costs to drive help someone out that is just getting started, (because that balance sheet would have helped me alot back in february) then i feel pretty good about that, if my farmer named posts annoy you, dont read the dang thing"

I think what he is trying to say and I might be wrong is that farmers are exempt from a lot of the expenses commercial drivers have to pay for. An example is if you drive a semi truck/trailer, truck, semi tractor within the state you farm, you don't have to have a CDL and are therefore not bound to the same rules as commercial drivers.

When strictly hauling your own grain in your home state (intrastate carrier), you don't need federal registration or a U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT) number and usually don't have to concern yourself with fuel tax registration, but this varies by state. Crossing state lines is a whole different ballgame.

Farmers, and God bless them all for what they do, get help from the federal government with programs such as CRP and other tax breaks. The American Truck Driver - we don't get breaks, we get cheap rates and headaches. Farmers don't rely on rates for trucking because they haul their own commodities or are supposed to. I know a few that haul commerically for pay and hide behind their farm plate and name.

Most farmers are not required to belong to a drug/alcohol consortium; whereas, all commercial truck drivers do. More expense for us. See exemption below:


Farm vehicle drivers when the vehicle is:

  • Controlled and operated by a farmer as a private motor carrier of property
  • Being used to transport agricultural products or farm machinery and/or supplies to or from a farm
  • Not being used in the operation of a for-hire carrier
  • Not carrying placardable HM
  • Being used within 150 air miles of the farm

Farmers, for the most part, do not have the cost of operating a commercial truck as owner/operators do who haul on a daily basis and not just for planting/harvest.

Please don't bash me. I am a hard working woman married to a hard working man living in a farming community just stating the obvious.


Replied on Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 06:37 PM CST
Please keep in mind that many of us kept the farm name strictly because we had a tax id number. We still pull vans, refers, hoppers. Still have ifta. Still have e logs. Still have pro rated and commercial plates
Replied on Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 06:38 PM CST
+ 2
You make valid points. But sadly we do rely on your trucking rates. That's called basis. It's taken out of every bushel we haul in ourselv. Soybean basis is 1.70 per bushel. I'm not going to bash you. But I'd look into these government programs that we farmers get a little more closely to see where the money goes. But that's a different subject. Yes if farmers are hiding behind farm plates that's wrong, I'd turn them in. And honestly I don't know how they cash flow by having to dodge scales constantly. But if they are doing that, you are correct, that's an unfare advantage, I know in my state, they would never get away with it.

But I think us farmers on this website all have commercial plates, and I know my insurance premium for 1 truck 1 trailer is 14k. Trucking is how I earn my living because farming is not a profitable venture right now.
Replied on Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 06:38 PM CST
I personally am not exempt from anything except hauling my own product. 12 mile haul. I put on close to 2000 miles a week commercially and follow my hos the same as a refer or flatbed. We don't get any special treatment...unless someone is cheating
Replied on Thu, Nov 15, 2018 at 05:27 AM CST
+ 3
I apologise for getting worked up and rambling on but I've had two people explain the irrelevance of my opinion on rates because I'm a farmer. I'm also a commercial truck driver. Drug tests. Fmcsa. Everything.
Replied on Fri, Nov 16, 2018 at 01:50 PM CST
Some customer let me post rates - others do not.

One customer - really large ethanol and everything else billionaire company - got really upset with me for even posting their loads on BulkLoads - other brokers they use and employees they have that "can do the same thing" (but didn't) saw my posts paying more or whatever and got upset with the competition... and now I don't post their loads anywhere excpet internally... too bad because no one broker can know ever truck looking at these boards and their availabilty. Public posts are the best way to offer competitive pricing for the customer if you don't engage in bid wars with other brokers to a point where the customer is getting hurt by it.. I never do and the rates I do post when I post them are firm usually.

Other customers we have for grain runs in the midwest who also have access here don't seem to mind me posting up the rates - they have a set rate anyhow and will pay any broker that brings them a truck that same rate - they just want their loads moved. I love those customers - no limits on where I can get my trucks as long as they are legal and vetted.

Normally, I post new lanes up here and when I get a few local contacts I can rely on I just call them first when we have similar or repeat loads and it just goes without saying. Sometimes posting rates here causes backlash with drivers on contract to another company when they see they are getting $2-4 less per ton than what I am posting it for. Sometime I get pushback from drivers that know more than everyone else and me included and tell me how cheap I am - 5 dyas later they tend to ask for lanes that I have though.

Posting rates helps in some cases - others it more of a personal matter and needs to be discretely posted or worked so as not to cause heartache or other more complicated issues like contract changes or concerns with vendors and their suppliers.

Politics can be fierce. We just go with the flow and do what our clients tell us. For our bulk loads we don't have much guess work.. We get a rate usually from the shipper and we have to stick to it. Sometime there are random new lanes and we have to feel it out a little before giving a set rate... not the norm though..

A good broker might be a little less on one lane but slightly more than others on the return or another project right after... Brokers fill a void and can help keep you moving. Be nice to them when they deserve it. If they keep you busy and you are making fair wages - stick with them. I know a few I would avoid as a driver but that's because of the games and BS... We just stick to " Can you do it? When? Is this rate fair for you?" and get trucks rolling...

Cheers!
Replied on Fri, Nov 23, 2018 at 10:08 AM CST
Originally Posted by: DALE HERMANS
Quote: "I apologise for getting worked up and rambling on but I've had two people explain the irrelevance of my opinion on rates because I'm a farmer. I'm also a commercial truck driver. Drug tests. Fmcsa. Everything. "

Yup. I lost $200k this year because of the weather. Nothing I did, just the weather. And then you have to listen to all of these “experts” tell you since you don’t only drive trucks you don’t know anything about it. Of course, I have to listen to that from farmers too since I’m just a custom operator and not a “real” farmer. I think your opinions and operation is fine and I commend you for getting out and trying to dig yourself out of a hole rather than waiting for someone else to do it for you. I also wish people would look at things in a forum a bit more objectively and realize we are mostly in the same team! Now, having said that I’m going to go ask an engine question and see what kind of storm that unleashes. Ha!
Replied on Mon, Nov 26, 2018 at 08:19 AM CST
+ 3
Mr. Henderson, not once in your post did you even hint at advocating for the truck. Trucks are a dime a dozen ?

Art Pfluger
Replied on Sun, Dec 02, 2018 at 10:06 AM CST
+ 1
When you call the load is actually a hundred miles from where they posted it and delivers 100 from posted city. My first thought is if they can's post truthfully what else will they lie about. I know they give all sorts of BS reasons why they do it but I think it's just that the typical broker is so used to lieing that posting truthfully is hard for them to do.
Replied on Sun, Dec 02, 2018 at 10:06 AM CST
Thanks for your honesty and admitting your part of the problem. What is your cost per mile to move 80,000 down the hwy? Hauling for $1.25 is a losing proposition. You are paying money to haul freight! Does that make any sense?
Replied on Mon, Dec 03, 2018 at 08:10 AM CST
+ 2
We as independent drivers own our businesses. There for we should be the ones setting the rates .
I don't know what happened to this industry but seems to me everybody else is running our business not the owners.



Replied on Tue, Dec 04, 2018 at 08:37 AM CST
They don't seem to want it easy. Probably don't want any competitors knowing their rates.
Replied on Wed, Dec 05, 2018 at 10:31 AM CST
+ 4
I am Brian Johnson's other half and I work the load boards I have found that 1 load will go to 3 different brokers and there's 3 different rates and I call all of them. My driver thought that it was an easy just look on that load board grab a load and go until we started realizing that team A had it for $80 a ton, team B had it for $79 a ton, and team C had it for $83 a ton. some Brokers are really awesome and do try to help you find loads however you tend to get into the oh yeah I got you this load and then there's this other load and and you can then hold these three loads in a row right cuz it all lines up but come to find out the broker got the different loads from the different teams and then they had to take their 10% off of it and you just been better off emailing everybody. however other people on this post are correct you don't hear back from the people for forever. there were times we wouldn't hear back from people on the load board for 3 to 5 days. and honestly I hate when they post something and then they're like oh it's it's not really a load it we were just checking for rates. I've spoke to the makers of book loads and asked about this and they said they do try to turn people away from doing that but obviously they can't police it so sometimes that's hard and whoever the hell is hauling stuff for 1.40 a mile ,knock that s*** off LOL
Replied on Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 07:40 AM CST
+ 1

When a rate is too low, based on what I figure my cost per mile is, I will go empty before supporting someone's profit at my expense. Or will bounce farther to find that ethical rate. It is the principle of it and is necessary, if we are going to reveal true price discovery.

Replied on Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 10:09 AM CST
Randy look at all the B S the B S you started your seat is still here
Replied on Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 01:24 PM CST
One year after the ELD mandate everyone is still complaining about brokers and their rates. Barron's, Bloomberg, Wall Street journal as well as several other publications have all been talking about skyrocketing shipping rates and declining profits across the economy. The Dow Jones index seems to back this up. However it would appear that these increased rates we read about are not making their way into the carrier's pocket. Well if the shipper paid it, and you didn't see it, where did it go?
Replied on Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 03:52 PM CST
+ 1
Originally Posted by: RUSS WILLIAMS
Quote: "When you call the load is actually a hundred miles from where they posted it and delivers 100 from posted city. My first thought is if they can's post truthfully what else will they lie about. I know they give all sorts of BS reasons why they do it but I think it's just that the typical broker is so used to lieing that posting truthfully is hard for them to do."

Russ, I'm sorry if you've been burned by brokers but grouping all brokers together like that is not right. By that logic I can say all truck drivers are lazy 450lb greaseballs who can't find thei bunks behind the piles of garbage because I've met a few of them.
Replied on Sat, Jan 05, 2019 at 05:50 PM CST
CA being the exception!!! I have a new DOT # Drug testing and realy expensive Inc $10376.00 and not for hire!!!! I don't understand how anyone can make this work!
Replied on Sun, Jan 06, 2019 at 10:20 AM CST
Originally Posted by: JIM NOLTE
Quote: "Russ, I'm sorry if you've been burned by brokers but grouping all brokers together like that is not right. By that logic I can say all truck drivers are lazy 450lb greaseballs who can't find thei bunks behind the piles of garbage because I've met a few of them."

I wouldn't hold it against you if you said that.
Replied on Mon, Jan 07, 2019 at 07:17 AM CST
+ 4
If loads are posted without rates, that just simply means that they are negotible. USE IT TO YOUR ADVANTAGE.
(awaiting review) Replied on Sat, Jan 19, 2019 at 09:10 AM CST
Originally Posted by: AUGUSTO COTTE
Quote: "Sometimes our clients don't have a target rate. Also, soetimes there is a big gap in between the low, average and the high. This way carriers call in and I can relate that back to the customer, so their pay is more realistic."

You're right, most times if you see a posted rate it's a contracted rate.